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About Undertanker

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    Master Sergeant
  1. You need imp sunder until AQ gear. You need very specific threat per second gear paired with a lot of agility to justify impale spec, and be able to maintain world buffs throughout a raid. Can't get more than 3/5 if reaching both impale and shield slam. Shield Slam does more damage than Mortal Strike 1h. Block Value scales 1:1. Mortal Strike is bad threat per rage, requiring more use of your 15 rage Sunders. Where as I can shield slam + cleave and do more threat, more damage, with less rage. Mortal Strike spec doesn't get imp 1h, limiting incoming rage on white hit, negating any weapon specialization. Take anticipation talents so you can gear +hit % on two addition gear slots (rings). Yet maintain the ability to hit Def cap if ever needed. Imp Taunt allows for you to be able to hold a mob with challenging shout or mocking blow and taunt again before losing it. (If taunt resist). TL;DR Just go with standard tank spec. Pick up a weapon with a proc.
  2. @Zaroua What does Beserker rage have to do with tanking in these low level 5 mans for rage to open a fight with? Do you mean blood rage? Tanking 5 mans, you rarely get to charge into a group or you'll pull unwanted pats or the next set of mobs. Gun pulling, blood rage, battle shout (while still in range of all party members) is how you should open your pull. Also "how will you have enough rage for a start of a pull?" You should practice pooling your rage when you have established aggro on a mob for the next pull. More info in tank guides. The only struggle you will have is stance dance > mocking blow which late 30s imp beserker rage will give you 10 rage to counter this limitation. If impale does not effect autos, that makes enrage vs impale difference even in more favor of enrage but over 27.5% then since you also get more rage per second from Enrage. You quote me then talk about flurry, my leveling guide clearly says to respec at 40 to arms and why. You still have over power and will be doing more damage all the time with it because of Enrage. Also, overpower is not a "Major portion of your dps". Yes casters can dodge, but at a very low percent and shouldn't be banking on a 5 percent dodge trigger for your PVP win. This is more of a rogue killer for the tards that go evasion on you, or Hunters who by muscle memory go monkey when you get in melee range. Just because you are fury spec does not lock you out of battle stance. To your random stuff about people not being able to dps a 5 man, a fresh 60 warrior should remain arms as sweeping strikes does wonders on trash unless you are going full CC on every pull. Informative information has been provided long ago in this thread, with rhyme and reason, and plan ole' fashionable math. No reason to continue to try to turn chicken salad into chicken shit.
  3. In 5 mans can give up toughness by 1 point. most things that hurt with the exception of DM North boss are magic damage. (Scholo boss/ubrs boss/strat live & UD boss) Trash mobs that use magic hurt much more as well.
  4. Yeah I was told I had to wait til the 7th dropped before I could get one for tanking.
  5. Warm body that is there almost all the time will be taken over a better spec that isn't there for the guild much.
  6. OP specifically ask about solo and 5 mans. People jump right into raid discussion and never touch on half of what he/she is asking. I'll provide my feedback with playing with people in BiS BWL gear from both classes/specs, as I love spamming 5 mans as a tank when I don't need things, it's more fun than main city AFK. Boomkin: 5man Can do good burst DPS with a nuke and then moon fire spam on the bosses in a 5 man, won't see much different from a lock or mage due to the shortness of most 5 man fights. Locks won't have many chances for a free shadow bolt, mages can't get ignites going / shatter spec which is OP on trash won't help on the boss. The downside to the boomkin is while clearing trash, you will not have the mana efficiency or AoE damage of either lock or mage. The one AoE you do have, is a lot of unwanted threat due to the added debuff. Innervating yourself doesn't make up for this as the CD is greater than what any fast moving group will accommodate for. If it is a slow group that is drinking after most pulls, you shouldn't notice a difference. Also for the groups that have a squishy tank and CC wanted, you are limited in which instances you can help in. UBRS is where you'll shine the most. They help the tank with AoE threat as long as they keep thorns up, and gives the group MotW which is a plus. The healer and other caster dps also get a crit buff. Serve as a backup heal if healer dies somehow but too low mana for a BRez. Also for fights that might be hard in low gear, you can pre-rejuv/regrowth the tank to make the healers job much easier. Solo Solo wise: They are not very well off, and fall behind a feral as a feral will have no down time if balancing shapeshifting / utilizing 6 second non cast for mana regen between power shift heals/moonfire pulls. T2.5 is the holy grail of Druid solo gear, to allow your versatility to shine without noticeable weakness in any form. Retadin: 5man Does more consistent damage than burst. Not high damage, but consistent. In a favorable instance such as Strat UD, expect a BiS Ret with Hand of Rag to do on average 350-415 damage a second on the trash pulls. This is if you are going AoE style on the trash. Single Target Boss, expect more to 280-345 dps. While most keep their aura up for 10% more holy damage, I frequently request Ret Aura for more AoE tankability, which in turn allows them to go AoE heavy sooner in the pool. So their single target damage numbers I posted above could be a bit higher, it is best for the GROUP to use Ret when doing things as speed clearing 5 mans for the warrior to hold threat. Kings / Might / Wisdom what ever buff you got, will help speed the run up as well. Also you do have LoH in your back pocket, along with spot healing if needed. Utilize your stun more often than not, just not at the start of the pull or you will limit the warriors aggro gains. Solo Solo wise, they fair well for themselves due to their survival skills/bubbles/fast self heal, but with a lack of burst abilities at their disposal, grinding is a bit boring and damage is consistent. A slow weapon with a proc and DMC:Malstrom will help the pain of grinding/farming higher level mobs. Raid (since others mention it) For those that love to only talk Raid: Ret: Night fall 100% of the time in 40 mans to make up for their 300-400 dps with great gear. (note: all off tanks should also have a nightfall for when they are not tanking to help increase uptime). And they should also have a good MP5 set and be a cleanse-bot for fights that require it to free up a healer to focus on healing. (Auto-Nightfall/Cleanse on these fights). Boomkin: BiS will look really good in a guild that clears really fast with moonfire spam, they can get up their on the meters with a ToeP style trinket rolling for the duration. Talking MC zerg boss type fights. You'll see 800-900 DPS on a 16 second Luci kill (if raid tanks the adds while burning the boss). Fights that go longer than 20-30 seconds, they drop substantially in terms of DPS. We all know the buff they bring to a fire mage group - while world buffed, this buff is nil. Without world buffs, another mage keeping the ignite rolling would be better, as they only need 12% base spell crit to break even with the buff with other 4 mages would have gotten. If you do bring one though, same rule with pally, they better have an MP5 set as well for decurse fights to free up a mage to DPS. Also better watch healer mana, innervate your best w/o them having to ask, as often as you can.
  7. ...... read the entire thread. Again, from commenting on a different person who stated only getting 5/5 cruelty rest arms, you are lvl 35 when you get SS. My post also point out and reference: before you went on your power trip. Mind you, because you argue SS at 30, you don't get the 5% crit, so your whit hit formulas then need to be made using 8% crit instead of 13% crit which we did for the comparison of impale vs enrage which enrage was 20%+ better. ...... Today I learned you can not be in Beserker stance unless you have TM. How can I not use Beserker rage and Intercept. Remember Imp Beserker rage is also in the talent tree for fury late 30s. I'm done responding to this ignorance.
  8. We would always roll together. You get your buffs together, so why spread out at the last second. We'd all do a countdown and take the FP at the same time. GG for any body on the receiving end of this We then wait at the bottom part of TP, and everybody run the pace of how fast the 60% mounts can run. Don't go ahead on your 100%. Kill EVERYBODY on the way. Red = Dead. People can then zone in w/o losing buffs.
  9. guide

    Disarm, if using a debuff time as a threat multiplier, would improved disarm then give slightly more threat based on the increased % the talents give? Not game breaking by any means either way seeing as spending into it is considered a sub-par protection spec.
  10. How am I avoiding this? I was commenting on the statement saying Fury gave no upside til mid 30s and compared talents obtainable on a same level. Impale at lvl 31 vs what you reach in the fury tree at 29. The comparison is Enrage vs Impale. And these comparisons only accounting for raw damage done, not even factoring in the 20%+ more rage per second you generate from the damage done alone in fury. If you want to discuss Sweeping strikes, which is obtainable at level 35 (if incorporating the 5% crit from fury as mentioned before): http://db.vanillagaming.org/?talent#LbGhbIboZV You have to compare it to what you can have at lvl 35 in fury: http://db.vanillagaming.org/?talent#LZVVuhMxoz Which gives lower execute cost, more damage on cleave, Death Wish, and starting to work into Flurry. In regards to PVP, I only suggest taking Fury until 40. Pre-30 you don't have Berzk stance, so stance dance for OP isn't an issue til after lvl 30, when you can then have that option in arms. I'd rather just be able to pop Death Wish and drop your ass to execute phase really fast, which remember my executes cost less = do more damage if both specs are done at 15 rage (due to excess rage conversion). Imp Overpower will also only be available when fighting a melee class, limited class benefit. I still have Overpower in Fury, and will do close to same amount of damage on average. Enrage + Deathwish is not class dependent and destroy casters and leather wearers. The "if you had a healer" arms is better makes no sense either. Assuming a leveling partner since you have to assume they are always with you. You have to give the healer to both sides of the argument. In which case, BloodCraze isn't needed to mitigate the increase damage taken on a purposeful crit and you can then take booming voice instead to help in PVP finding druids and rogues, as well give more rage to you due to less times using Battle Shout, and less likely to lose it in a world pvp situation mid fight due to it dropping off. Oh and Piercing Howl? - Hello. Arms you are more likely to get kited if you get caught out of hamstring range. At level 35 and before neither spec have weapon dependability so that argument is pretty much nil. (again assuming you took 5/5 cruelty) All 2Hs are viable for either spec and weapon speed does not matter. Only DPS of the weapon. My napkin math may or may not be correct, but should yield roughly the same result of 20%+ damage in Fury on white hits, as long as you use the same formula for both specs. If there is anything else I am "avoiding" please let me know.
  11. guide

    Base threat and threat from damage done are different. Cleave should have a base threat of 100 threat + how ever much damage you do. Heroic Strike should have a base threat of 175 + how ever much damage you do. While you are informed to cleave on fights such as Val so you don't supersede the secondary tank, it still has a base threat value so you till can climb the meters more than just from your damage output.
  12. guide

    Also another example is shield bash. It has a base threat and the damage done, and additional threat when successful interrupt. There is no "tool tip" information stating this. Kenco's Threat Guide explains the values.
  13. guide

    Battle shout causes threat, but doesn't say it in it's tool tip
  14. guide

    HS and cleave should be the same if I recall correctly. The base threat values will differ with Heroic Strike being more Threat per second. Cleave should give a base threat for the 2 mobs hit by it + damage done. Same as Heroic strike, a base threat for the 1 mob hit + damage done.