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Elicas

AQ opening event

43 posts in this topic

Thanks for the find @Arwy!

@Darkrasp - Arwy has found conclusive proof that the auto-complete was around during feb 2006 (1.9), including proof that the event could auto-complete before a guild has finished the scepter quest to ring the gong. Just tagging you so you can now add it to the list of blizzlike things that this server will be running that most others don't.

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19 minutes ago, Elicas said:

Thanks for the find @Arwy!

@Darkrasp - Arwy has found conclusive proof that the auto-complete was around during feb 2006 (1.9), including proof that the event could auto-complete before a guild has finished the scepter quest to ring the gong. Just tagging you so you can now add it to the list of blizzlike things that this server will be running that most others don't.

Yep. But the auto complete was designed for low population realms,  the original 'working as intended' assumed you were enough coordinated as a community to fulfill the tasks.

For me, the original concept should hold precedent unless there are issues on population numbers on any realm. That would mean less than 1000 peak pop.

The original AQ40 war effort event is iron man vanilla and ensure the community on both sides has to work constructively to fulfill a desired goal. This can mean for example, alliance creating horde toons just to get over the line.

 

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37 minutes ago, Outstanding said:

The original AQ40 war effort event is iron man vanilla and ensure the community on both sides has to work constructively to fulfill a desired goal. This can mean for example, alliance creating horde toons just to get over the line.

I'm mostly an alliance guy but I'm probably going to have some horde toons this time around too because I just want to see everything.  And I'll happily contribute to effort with whatever toon I'm rolling with that day.  One of the cool things about that event was that it was designed to allow lowbies to make a contribution too with low level bandages and herbs and metal.

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43 minutes ago, Outstanding said:

Yep. But the auto complete was designed for low population realms,  the original 'working as intended' assumed you were enough coordinated as a community to fulfill the tasks.

For me, the original concept should hold precedent unless there are issues on population numbers on any realm. That would mean less than 1000 peak pop.

The original AQ40 war effort event is iron man vanilla and ensure the community on both sides has to work constructively to fulfill a desired goal. This can mean for example, alliance creating horde toons just to get over the line.

 

Irrelevant. This was implemented to prevent people from hording mass amounts of the low level turn ins to artificially inflate the length of the war effort to generate more people with the title and black scarabs, which is something the 'top' guilds will do here as well, if any comes over from nost.

Finishing before 60 days is the boon you get for being coordinated enough to fulfill the tasks, there's literally no need to leave out blizzlike functionality.

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The auto-complete is a core mecanic. My server was considered high pop at the time but we were at a huge ratio alliance 70 /horde 30 . Alliance finished its war effort in February while we had to wait for the autocomplete feature to do the job for horde.

 

Every server finished 1st week of March (beside the newly created which finished 1 month later), i still can't believe you doubt it was not implemented on all server.

 

What you don't understand is that people farmed this event like crazy for the fame and the competition between server. When this motive isn't there, people wont bother, it's just a pain to do.

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34 minutes ago, Elicas said:

Irrelevant. This was implemented to prevent people from hording mass amounts of the low level turn ins to artificially inflate the length of the war effort to generate more people with the title and black scarabs, which is something the 'top' guilds will do here as well, if any comes over from nost.

Finishing before 60 days is the boon you get for being coordinated enough to fulfill the tasks, there's literally no need to leave out blizzlike functionality.

Well, that's one way of looking at it. But it seems to me that the intention is purely to allow low population realms to trigger the AQ event when there is no chance that it will be completed in a timely fashion. This can also be down to a disparity to numbers on each faction. I don't see any evidence to show that this was designed purely to avoid exploits.

What I don't understand is if this part of the original 1.9 AQ patch, or was it something that was brought in later? Clearly there's no documentation to show this one way or the other or we'd have it by this stage. I don't think the issue people have is over the title and the mount, it's really about the delay tactics involved and that people want to get the realms moving through AQ40 and Naxx and then TBC. Right?

The AQ40 war effort is the biggest economic and cross-factional event in WoW. Therefore it can and should be exploited by those of us who have an interest in these things. I've already said that my intention is to start preparation for the AQ40 effort guild-wise from the very start, this should remove any chance that the guilds on the horde side can manipulate the war event on our side.

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54 minutes ago, Outstanding said:

Well, that's one way of looking at it. But it seems to me that the intention is purely to allow low population realms to trigger the AQ event when there is no chance that it will be completed in a timely fashion. This can also be down to a disparity to numbers on each faction. I don't see any evidence to show that this was designed purely to avoid exploits.

What I don't understand is if this part of the original 1.9 AQ patch, or was it something that was brought in later? Clearly there's no documentation to show this one way or the other or we'd have it by this stage. I don't think the issue people have is over the title and the mount, it's really about the delay tactics involved and that people want to get the realms moving through AQ40 and Naxx and then TBC. Right?

The AQ40 war effort is the biggest economic and cross-factional event in WoW. Therefore it can and should be exploited by those of us who have an interest in these things. I've already said that my intention is to start preparation for the AQ40 effort guild-wise from the very start, this should remove any chance that the guilds on the horde side can manipulate the war event on our side.

If you read all the links Arwy provided, it was discovered in February 2006. The original 1.9 patch dropped on January 3rd, and every server that had 1.9 patched in January had completed the AQ event due to either player input or the auto-complete by the middle of march. 60 days is the blizzlike length of the AQ event, anything longer than that is gating raids for the sake of dragging out content you haven't scripted yet.

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2 minutes ago, Elicas said:

If you read all the links Arwy provided, it was discovered in February 2006. The original 1.9 patch dropped on January 3rd, and every server that had 1.9 patched in January had completed the AQ event due to either player input or the auto-complete by the middle of march. 60 days is the blizzlike length of the AQ event, anything longer than that is gating raids for the sake of dragging out content you haven't scripted yet.

Yea I'm convinced. My memory was bad mainly because both my own realms (Thunderhorn + Bronzebeard) completed it on their own. I assumed it was patched in later approaching BC. Just didn't think it was 60 days from kickoff but Awry's links are pretty convincing.

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2 hours ago, Elicas said:

stuff    

 

Right, no I get that. What I'm saying is that just because it was discovered in February doesn't mean it wasn't part of the original 1.9 AQ patch, and I presume there's no way of knowing. So no-one can contend whether it was designed for low population realms, or to prevent manipulation of the event, or both. 

 

 

 

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I agree that having the autocomplete working is pretty much a necessity due to the nature of private server shenanigans.

Thanks for the data on this, I suspect we should be able to script things to a very high degree of accuracy now.  I suppose the only question is the preferred method of implementation..

It is 30 days with no autocomplete followed by ~3.3% per day, or ~1.7% per day from the start?  Or is it just a calculated fraction of what is left such that it completes *on* the 60th day, regardless of how much players contribute?

I'd think ~1.7% per day is the most logical.  However, being Blizzard, I tend to think they went with the 30 days no auto / 30 days 3.3% per day route.

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7 minutes ago, Darkrasp said:

 However, being Blizzard, I tend to think they went with the 30 days no auto / 30 days 3.3% per day route.

Awry's find from allakhazam supports this scenario.

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To be fair, it urges guild to make a choice and nominate someone or 2 to get the Qiraj Warmount, this feel blizzlike and a true achievement. On the other project so many people got it, it was nothing special to get it.

Aswell AQ40 was too easy on the other project mainly because they dragged BWL for months (many had time to get 2 or more chars BIS geared to adapt to any situation), while in retail, despite being CL/RL and with a DKP system i wasn't full t2 as hunter yet (and i was in a performing guild)

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Our intention is to push instances at a pretty fast pace.  Players won't have time to fully farm an instance before the next raid tier is released unless they get absurdly lucky with drops.

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20 minutes ago, Darkrasp said:

Our intention is to push instances at a pretty fast pace.  Players won't have time to fully farm an instance before the next raid tier is released unless they get absurdly lucky with drops.

I'm really glad to hear that. On one progressive WotLK server Naxx took so long that the population started declining. Everyone was in full BiS by the time Ulduar released. Even though it was pre-nerf uld it got easy. Would be nice if people still had pieces of dungeon gear and to see a much bigger use of consumables (eg potions that are quite unused there).

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1 hour ago, Arwy said:

To be fair, it urges guild to make a choice and nominate someone or 2 to get the Qiraj Warmount, this feel blizzlike and a true achievement. On the other project so many people got it, it was nothing special to get it.

Aswell AQ40 was too easy on the other project mainly because they dragged BWL for months (many had time to get 2 or more chars BIS geared to adapt to any situation), while in retail, despite being CL/RL and with a DKP system i wasn't full t2 as hunter yet (and i was in a performing guild)

Actually, this is a very good point. By pushing raid content through as quickly as possible, you reduce the amount of BiS gear they cart over to the next raid. I suspect that the reason why raid content is so slow on other Pservers is to extend the relevancy of the server. On CF, being PTE that becomes an impediment. End result is that those that get the mount, clear AQ40 and clear Naxx get to complete a real achievement. 

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1 hour ago, Outstanding said:

Actually, this is a very good point. By pushing raid content through as quickly as possible, you reduce the amount of BiS gear they cart over to the next raid. I suspect that the reason why raid content is so slow on other Pservers is to extend the relevancy of the server. On CF, being PTE that becomes an impediment. End result is that those that get the mount, clear AQ40 and clear Naxx get to complete a real achievement. 

I couldn't agree more !

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6 hours ago, Darkrasp said:

However, being Blizzard, I tend to think they went with the 30 days no auto / 30 days 3.3% per day route.

Using those sources, that is what they did.

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12 hours ago, Elicas said:

Irrelevant. This was implemented to prevent people from hording mass amounts of the low level turn ins to artificially inflate the length of the war effort to generate more people with the title and black scarabs, which is something the 'top' guilds will do here as well, if any comes over from nost.

At least only one person here (well, two, but we can't rely on both servers to get there, either PvErs will get stuck fishing or PvPers will get stuck in Stranglethorn) can get the title.

11 hours ago, Outstanding said:

The AQ40 war effort is the biggest economic and cross-factional event in WoW.

Actually it's the biggest event in wow, period. The whole war with Qiraji thing. Zombie invasions of Naxxramas and Northrend breathing-on-the-neck-close second, but while there was mass mayhem and battles, the economic aspect where everyone was busy working on something was missing. Imo Blizzard never made anything as big as the two last vanilla raid events again.

 

 

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