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Pvt_8Ball

A minor suggestion for the extra strikes system

40 posts in this topic

Posted (edited)

@Veritch what I did is basically attacking something twice every second for 300000 seconds (83.3 hours) doing 150dmg with each hit.

@Pvt_8Ball This is with WF only giving 1 strike and WF>HoJ:

Screenshot_13.png

But remember, the chances here are so low (HoJ proccing on extra strikes also proccing WF) that 600000 strikes is not remotely enough, when I do it with 60 million strikes it still varies between 0.12% to 0.18% for WF (2 extra) and 0.14% to 0.19% for WF totem over the runs I did.

Edited by coolmodi
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Posted (edited)

so in retrospec, its a 0.12% nerf to a 1% build that sees about 1% of gameplay....

not sure why this is a big debate.

and its the closest to blizzlike...

thinky face.jpg

Edited by imbaslap
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Posted (edited)

@imbaslap It isn't a big debate, everyone involved in the discussion understands that it's a very minor thing, it was known from the start that we're talking a less than 1% dps difference. At this point, it's just an exercise in curiosity, the thread concluded many posts ago. The reason I made the thread in the first place was more for the sake of the system itself, rather than any sort of tangible ingame benefit.

Edited by Pvt_8Ball
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Posted (edited)

That's why I was saying Windfury Weapon and Windfury Totem are different, the part where it makes a difference is for Windfury Totem with Ironfoe. If/when they both proc on the initial hit. Shamans run with 2h anyway.

Edited by Ulver
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Yup, it's not a big deal, but I thought an interesting catch by Pvt.  It also looks like you can enact a solution that provides relief to the problem already or else you couldn't test it, so even though small, why not? 

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1 hour ago, Ulver said:

That's why I was saying Windfury Weapon and Windfury Totem are different, the part where it makes a difference is for Windfury Totem with Ironfoe. If/when they both proc on the initial hit. Shamans run with 2h anyway.

Yeah, that's fair, it does change how the proc chances behave and so forth. Although it doesn't matter too much, since it's the underlying mechanics I'm more concerned about, not how they interact with specific weapon combinations.

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Posted (edited)

4 hours ago, imbaslap said:

 

and its the closest to blizzlike...

 

First, I dont have a horse in this race really so no biggie, don't let this opening line be lost on you. Its all good brother, but...

It is blizzlike only in the coding idea, which had multiple iterations and isnt accurately being reproduced as currently implemented for what the goal is/was.  But it is not as blizzlike in the results due to coding difficulties darkrasp mentioned. That is an important distinction. But either way, not a huge deal.  I'll likely never personally use any of those items so its not a personal thing. It is what it is.

 

Edit: and it appears that the result could be programmed to be more blizzlike based off us being able to test it, so why not make the result blizzlike.  

Ok seriously, I'm done with the thread. Do what you please, it won't bother me a bit. But I'm glad I picked up on this thread and learned a bit about how these mechanics work.  Was a fun convo

Edited by Veritch
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34 minutes ago, Veritch said:

It is blizzlike only in the coding idea, which had multiple iterations and isnt accurately being reproduced as currently implemented for what the goal is/was.  But it is not as blizzlike in the results due to coding difficulties darkrasp mentioned. That is an important distinction. But either way, not a huge deal.  I'll likely never personally use any of those items so its not a personal thing. It is what it is.

 

Edit: and it appears that the result could be programmed to be more blizzlike based off us being able to test it, so why not make the result blizzlike.  

 

I'm not sure I understand what you're saying.

Having the most powerful proc take precedence on any given swing is blizzlike, so I don't know what you're on about here.

The only thing about the system I've got that isn't blizzlike is the ability for items which grant extra strikes to proc off themselves, which was possible for a while in retail but was eventually nerfed.  We're starting with it nerfed and leaving it that way.  The clamor in here is for an un-blizzlike change, which would be so negligible a buff that it would be nearly impossible to even notice a difference in-game.  How this topic always manages to spiral out of control like this is utterly beyond me.

I said I would look at it, but it's unlikely that I'm going to make any changes to the system as it is already described.

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Posted (edited)

I really hate to be posting about this subject again, but I just wanted to correct a mistake I made, if we're comparing my modified system to Dark's system, with WF totem and HoJ both active, HoJ sees a 0.4% nerf to how many swings it grants, and if it was WF totem + sword spec, it's be a 1% nerf to how many swings sword spec would grant.

Edited by Pvt_8Ball
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This is one of those topics that, from a developer point of view, is quite interesting; the problem here is that the topic has been settled time ago and these are the kind of topics a developer should not be spending his time on now; maybe after launch, but not now. So although I really enjoy this discussion, please just focus on the beta; after launch there will be plenty of time in order to address these kind of topics.

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6 minutes ago, HarTstaRx said:

these are the kind of topics a developer should not be spending his time on now

Why not? Its not like devs cant be wrong,game is 10+ years old.Do u remember holy resistance saga?U remember developers posts about it?

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Posted (edited)

4 hours ago, Sallerius said:

Why not? Its not like devs cant be wrong,game is 10+ years old.Do u remember holy resistance saga?U remember developers posts about it?

Of course, talk is always healthy; and sure, anybody can be wrong. I just mean that devs shouldn't spend time on this now, for various reasons:

  • The topic has been addressed and settled.
  • It's in a state more than ok for release and even more than ok for open beta.
  • There are topics of higher priority to address first.

This is the kind of discussion that tends people to think devs should have someone managing their time or priorities, if you don't want the figure because you wan to run the show your way that's great but don't put more wood into the fire.

I guess what I mean is that this topic can be perfectly addressed after the open beta or even after release, the server is not gonna die without this fix being applied now.

Of course the devs are the owners of the show and they can run it however they like, that's up to them.

Edited by HarTstaRx
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2 hours ago, HarTstaRx said:

I guess what I mean is that this topic can be perfectly addressed after the open beta

But, we dont know when open beta will hit.From ur post, it seems like "beta is near, dont bother with minor things".Maybe someone will post something that will change Darkrasp mind...who knows.

 

2 hours ago, HarTstaRx said:

talk is always healthy

+1

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17 hours ago, Darkrasp said:

 

I'm not sure I understand what you're saying.

Having the most powerful proc take precedence on any given swing is blizzlike, so I don't know what you're on about here.

The only thing about the system I've got that isn't blizzlike is the ability for items which grant extra strikes to proc off themselves, which was possible for a while in retail but was eventually nerfed.  We're starting with it nerfed and leaving it that way.  The clamor in here is for an un-blizzlike change, which would be so negligible a buff that it would be nearly impossible to even notice a difference in-game.  How this topic always manages to spiral out of control like this is utterly beyond me.

I said I would look at it, but it's unlikely that I'm going to make any changes to the system as it is already described.

All well and good, but when will holy resistance be fixed?

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