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spookyskeleton

10 Rogue PVP Specs

 

#1 - 21/8/22 daggers/prep/coldblood http://db.vanillagaming.org/?talent#fue0RxzZGcZVMecc0o

#2 - 21/3/27 hemo/prep/coldblood http://db.vanillagaming.org/?talent#fhebRLzZhZxMeochRk

#3 - 16/3/32 hemo/prep/premed http://db.vanillagaming.org/?talent#fhebRZhZxMeochRqo

#4 -  13/3/35 hemo/prep/premed + switch weapon ambush http://db.vanillagaming.org/?talent#fuIboZhZfMeschRqo

#5 - 11/17/23 toolbox (hemo/prep/imp sprint/imp kick/riposte) http://db.vanillagaming.org/?talent#fMIboZG0xdrZfMxRchoo

#6 - 0/26/25 hemo/prep/mace spec http://db.vanillagaming.org/?talent#fZhxxdr0tZxMgochRo

#7 - 31/8/12 seal fate daggers http://db.vanillagaming.org/?talent#fGeboxzAoGcZVMhM

#8 - 29/0/22 hemo/prep/coldblood/seal fate http://db.vanillagaming.org/?talent#fdebRxzNZZfMxcMhoo

#9 - 2/31/18 combat/subtlety/improved sap http://db.vanillagaming.org/?talent#f0bZGLxdr0t0coxMgoc

#10 - 11/31/9 combat focused http://db.vanillagaming.org/?talent#f0eboZGLxdr0t0coxMb

*green means this spec is extra dank

 

Some of these are really fun. I'll go over the less commonly seen / more unusual ones.

A few specs similar to 21/3/27 that you dont see as often, even though they're still really good, are #3, #4 and #5. First two because subtlety just has so much good shit, and #5 because combat does too, you can get a lot of utility out of imp sprint and kick and riposte and shorter cds, that's why it's called toolbox. #6 is good for the same reason as #5 but with even more utility: mace spec and blade flurry, but you lose the early assassination stuff.

#8 is the complete opposite of #6, and relies heavily on gear to work. You want to stack crit as much as possible - 15 agi on each weapon, crit trinkets, the works, and watch the combo points pour in from hemorrhage. Who needs gouge anyways? I'd recommend either full t3, or 5 piece t2.5 + 4 piece t3 with the ring, since you'll be eviscerating literally all the time. Especially hilarious with dragonslayer buff.

#9 and #10 aren't that "unusual", just combat specs, but nobody really considers combat that good for pvp, when it definitely can be. You lose prep so it definitely takes more skill, but adrenaline rush is amazing if you know when to use it. In wpvp especially when you might be waiting 5 mins between kills anyways, it's nice every 5 min to be able to turn into a killing machine on demand.

 

Edited by spookyskeleton
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You list 10 different builds but most are the same build with just a few points moved around. In Classic, a level 60 Rogue basically has 2 builds.

Build A: 21/x/21+: This is the PvP build with the most control, and burst damage, thanks to Cold Blood, which can be popped twice (Prep). This is what most Rogues run. Literally 99% of Rogues that gank you or are in BGs have this build. They gain CPs quickly, can easily control an entire fight, then guarantee Evis crits to finish you off. If you even survive the first round, they can double pop every CD they have and do it all over again. It's also not bad to solo farm with or run dungeons if they simply slot Hemo, which gives them a cheap frontal strike. It's only weakness is that it lacks sustained DPS, falling miles behind a Combat Rogue in this regard. It focuses on controlling a fight, and using Evis crits for damage. Typically, this is run with a dagger, since Backstab will stomp the piss out of Hemo when you're behind the target.

Build B: 11+/31+/x: This build maximizes DPS output, and is the only ideal build for a raider. It doesn't matter if you want a sword or dagger, it's still the top build. It has too many things going for it vs the other trees in terms of sustained DPS. Weapon skill, hit chance, harder offhand swings, and a weapon spec for another 5% crit or proc. Then there's the Adrenaline Rush, which is a winner over anything else in the Rogue arsenal during a boss fight. Even without the ability used, you can easily out DPS anyone else that isn't Combat. Evis is trash vs raid boss, even with crits. What weapon you use is up for preference. It just means switching between Imp SS/BS, and Dagger/Sword. But the big MH will solo mobs easier, if you also want to farm on the character. Dagger Combat Rogues cannot farm as effectively. Personally I preferred daggers, as I did not need to use my Rogue to farm on Nost. I had 5 60s, and what I farmed on my Rogue was just thorium for the most part.

Vigor: This is complete trash. Adrenaline Rush or Dirty Deeds both do a better job of giving you energy when you need it.
Premeditation: Sacrificing Cold Blood for this thing is like going full retard. You're sacrificing 2 guaranteed Evis crits for an extra 2 CPs you don't even need. It'd be more tempting if Prep did not affect CB, but in Classic, it does. They did not nerf Prep, removing CB from the reset, until after Classic. This is why CB is so good, and Premed is not.

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On 20-9-2016 at 1:02 PM, spookyskeleton said:

#4 -  13/3/35 hemo/prep/premed + switch weapon ambush http://db.vanillagaming.org/?talent#fuIboZhZfMeschRqo

#5 - 11/17/23 toolbox (hemo/prep/imp sprint/imp kick/riposte) http://db.vanillagaming.org/?talent#fMIboZG0xdrZfMxRchoo

#8 - 29/0/22 hemo/prep/coldblood/seal fate http://db.vanillagaming.org/?talent#fdebRxzNZZfMxcMhoo

#9 - 2/31/18 combat/subtlety/improved sap http://db.vanillagaming.org/?talent#f0bZGLxdr0t0coxMgoc

*green means this spec is extra dank

 

 

 

 

Some talents here, some talents there. Look how pretty these talents are sprinkled all over the place. If you can't choose one talent, why not take em all?

e6cd1ea2faca5c4c83c820ee8c94a0c9.jpg 

Sprinkles are extra dank.

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2 hours ago, RipTonight said:

 

Some talents here, some talents there. Look how pretty these talents are sprinkled all over the place. If you can't choose one talent, why not take em all?

e6cd1ea2faca5c4c83c820ee8c94a0c9.jpg 

Sprinkles are extra dank.

 

I wish we could choose them all. Imagine a 31/31/31 spec on a rogue, or a mage. Would be pure carnage.

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On 9/26/2016 at 10:03 PM, Drain said:

You list 10 different builds but most are the same build with just a few points moved around. In Classic, a level 60 Rogue basically has 2 builds.

(lists builds)

Vigor: This is complete trash. Adrenaline Rush or Dirty Deeds both do a better job of giving you energy when you need it.

Premeditation: Sacrificing Cold Blood for this thing is like going full retard. You're sacrificing 2 guaranteed Evis crits for an extra 2 CPs you don't even need. It'd be more tempting if Prep did not affect CB, but in Classic, it does. They did not nerf Prep, removing CB from the reset, until after Classic. This is why CB is so good, and Premed is not.

1. Yah a few of them are similar, but a lot of them aren't, like the 29/0/22 one, or 11/17/23, or 0/26/25. I wanted to list everything that's in some way viable, even if it's not ideal 100% of the time, which no spec is. So yah most of them aren't quite as versatile as 21/8/22 or 21/3/27 (Although I'd argue that toolbox - 11/17/23 is the most versatile overall, sacrificing some damage for it), but the point is they're all individually better or worse in certain situations, for different purposes, you see what I'm saying? Depends entirely on what class your fighting, how many players you're fighting, world pvp vs battlegrounds, gear levels, etc. Besides if I just listed the same 2-4 specs everyone already knows it would be a pretty pointless thread, wouldn't it?

2. Vigor isn't the point dummy. The point is seal fate, vigor is just a talent you can pick up for 1 point since it's right there. You could also go 30/8/13 for the extra crit on ambush, but I think vigor is better personally. But seriously, have you really never heard of seal fate as a pvp build before? Or just think it's bad and don't recognize it as a valid spec? lol Because that's basically the cookie cutter version of it. Watch this if you want to get an idea of it, or just cause it's a good video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VX7RuUcd-3Q  Yah you lose prep, but you get some cool stuff in return, mainly lots of potential combo points and burst in a very short time. I believe this spec is at it's best around the start to the middle of progression, when most are in T1 or T2 and still die fast.

3. Only thing that went full retard is your post. On topic: premed. Don't know why you're hating on premed, it's a good talent. But besides that it's not even the only reason to go deeper into subtlety. Don't forget you also get 5/5 deadliness, so 10% more attack power. If you're going swords, it's better than the talents like lethality you have to pick up to get to to cold blood. The premed specs aren't something you'd want to use with bad gear, but when you're in full T3 with a misplaced servo-arm or gressil, dawn of ruin, the scaling of all your attack power and gear starts really getting crazy. I've played a spec like this before in T2 on Nost and trust me it's works. 2 free combo points (4 with prep) means you get earlier and and stronger finishers, so you can do things like land a 5 point expose armour right near the start of the fight, no problem. Basically it speeds up how fast you can fire off your abilities and go through rotations. I'm convinced that at a certain gear level those points in subtlety are a lot more valuable than cold blood. You'll be doing more than enough damage already, your eviscerate not critting is irrelevant. 

4. Don't h8, m8. Appreci8. <3 

Edited by spookyskeleton
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I agree with you about Seal Fate (ofc <3), although I'd say if you're ungeared you might be better off playing 21/8/22 (or hemo or whatever), I think SF is a bit more gear-dependant than 21/8/22, if you don't have enough crit it might be a bit frustrating, at least that's my experience.

 

I also agree about Premeditation, it's kinda nice once you got AQ and beyond gear. When you start to have like 30-35% crit unbuffed and tons of AP to scale with Deadliness, CB remains nice but I think a Prem spec isn't such a bad idea.

You either Evisc your opponent @ 5 CP right after the opening, or EA right away if the fight requires it.

You lose the control of your burst that CB offers, so I guess it's also a matter of taste.

Edited by Youfie
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27 minutes ago, Youfie said:

I agree with you about Seal Fate (ofc <3), although I'd say if you're ungeared you might be better off playing 21/8/22 (or hemo or whatever), I think SF is a bit more gear-dependant than 21/8/22, if you don't have enough crit it might be a bit frustrating, at least that's my experience.

 

You might have a point. I think with better gear the other specs just scale better than seal fate though. But I could be wrong. It'd definitely still kick ass with some good gear and daggers, and would be more reliable on combo points too. I'll definitely try it out when the time comes.

Edited by spookyskeleton
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Different people like different specs and that's okay, however some stuff in your specs is just plain wrong. Cold Blood specs like #1 and #2 absolutely must have 5/5 Lethality, any Cold Blood spec must have 5/5 Lethality, CB+Evis would be your main burst and there's no excuse for not making it 30% stronger.

Same goes for Dirty Deeds in Hemo specs, by ignoring it in #2 and #6 (Setup, really?) you're literally handicapping yourself by 20 energy in each fight you start.

Also, mixing hemo and daggers has always been considered to be a pretty terrible idea by most rogues, but I'll leave that up to your taste.

 

Edited by Ghostly
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1 hour ago, Ghostly said:

Different people like different specs and that's okay, however some stuff in your specs is just plain wrong. Cold Blood specs like #1 and #2 absolutely must have 5/5 Lethality, any Cold Blood spec must have 5/5 Lethality, CB+Evis would be your main burst and there's no excuse for not making it 30% stronger.

Same goes for Dirty Deeds in Hemo specs, by ignoring it in #2 and #6 (Setup, really?) you're literally handicapping yourself by 20 energy in each fight you start.

Also, mixing hemo and daggers has always been considered to be a pretty terrible idea by most rogues, but I'll leave that up to your taste.

 

Lethality doesn't affect eviscerate.

You're probably right about dirty deeds though, just updated 2 and 6. And 1, thought I had 5/5 lethality already on there.

 

Edited by spookyskeleton
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20 minutes ago, spookyskeleton said:

Lethality doesn't affect eviscerate.

Aw dammit, look at me forgetting basic stuff. Still, you might want to give it more attention. I'm pretty sure that it outweighs the benefits of Murder, especially with at a higher gear level. It should be especially important in the good old 21/8/22, with Backstab crits and all.

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5 minutes ago, Ghostly said:

Aw dammit, look at me forgetting basic stuff. Still, you might want to give it more attention. I'm pretty sure that it outweighs the benefits of Murder, especially with at a higher gear level. It should be especially important in the good old 21/8/22, with Backstab crits and all.

Yah definitely 5/5 if you're going backstab.

Edited by spookyskeleton
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